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Marian
Posts:183
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| 11/22/2006 9:45 PM |
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Thanks for all of your thoughts and comments..
I had a very "good" rejection a few months back. The show required you to submit a SASE and my slides were not returned when I got the " too bad so sad " letter. HOWEVER, because I wanted my slides back, I wrote them and ask for them.
I got a VERY NICE personal note back from the person organizing the show. Not only did he mention that my submitted paintings "made it to the last round of judging" but he also suggested that I might be interested in helping with the judging in future shows.
WOW... what an opportunity to learn. I wrote back and volunteered my time. I figure I will be able to see the process first hand and really learn a bit about how work is judged.... at least for those shows.
Thanks again for all of your expertise, support and advice. It is very much appreciated. |
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Sometimes we paint to see more clearly or to feel more deeply.
Marian
www.marianfortunati.com
www.fortunatifineart.com |
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LauraLG
Posts:49
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| 11/25/2006 10:51 AM |
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Hi Marian,
Yes, the submission world has often left me bewildered. I got off to a good start, but slowly the accept/rejections started to tip one way then another. They say don't take it personally, but of course we do. I have learned that there are too many variables to what work is accepted or rejected. The preference of the judge/judges, the number of works submitted -vs- the number of works needed for the show etc. You'll go crazy trying to make sence of it.
So often I attend the show if I don't get in and look at the work and feel mine would have fit in (sometimes it wouldn't) but in either case, I just keep painting. I stay true to what excites me because it will come through in the work. If it bores me it will bore my audience as well. Slowly the list of exhibits grows. (I save the rejection forms as well) The point is that I'm actively working and actively sending it out there. -Laura |
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gene
Posts:1232
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| 11/26/2006 7:33 AM |
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| I belong to a great group of artists who hold a "Critique" meeting once a month. The group consists of quite a few professional and nationally known artists. Although I am really a fairly new artist, I regularly take my work to be put up in front of a group of at least 75 other artists. That takes a WHOLE lot of nerve, but I figure I'll never learn if I don't get help from others. I find that some will like a piece, some will remain silent while viewing it, some will give very instructive criticism, some will give very encouraging remarks, but rarely do any of them say anything absolutely rude or terribly discouraging remarks. I find that most artists are very supportive of a new artist's work. At least they are in this group. I am constantly amazed how supportive artists are of other's works. I also regularly submit work to some fantastic shows in my area. Sometimes I am rejected or "under-appreciated, as I like to call it". Sometimes I get a great surprise and my piece is accepted, even sometimes when other much better artists are rejected. I have really come to accept that it just depends what that particular judge likes or wants for that particular show. You have to just decide that you can't get hurt feelings! And, as I plug along, I am getting accepted into show more and more. So, I try to learn from whatever source I have, and keep on painting. It's really the process of creating the art that I truly enjoy, anyway. |
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Starrpoint
Posts:186
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| 11/26/2006 1:29 PM |
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This sounds like a wonderful, helpful group. Constructive critism is always encouraging. If you do not get some critism, you will not improve, but some think that by tearing others apart, it makes them better, more soficiated and knowing.
I think the better the artist, the more secure and helpful his or her words will be.
Sometimes, though, I wish I could get some feed back from shows as to why I was or was not accepted. Give me a clue! |
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Starrpoint*
www.tschantz.myexpose.com
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gene
Posts:1232
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| 11/28/2006 8:07 AM |
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| I've never received comments from the judge of the show. I don't think they have the time to do that, but I often will ask another artist who's critique I will respect what he/she thinks. How can I improve a particular spot, what they think of this area or that, how did I handle the values, etc., etc.,etc. I try not to take it personally if they find fault...........after all, I asked, didn't I? Have to develop a thick skin when asking for a critique, but we won't learn unless we are able to accept criticism. I have always found other artists to be honest, but very kind. I've also found that most artists won't find more than one or two areas to be critical of, so I ask someone else for their opinion. That way, I get a lot of input. But again, I just don't think a jurist of a particular show has the time for that. |
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Starrpoint
Posts:186
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| 11/28/2006 1:43 PM |
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This is true, that jurors for shows may not have time to critique work, sometimes even a small comment or hint will be all that is needed to help new artists understand the process.
I wish some of these shows would hold workshops on how to present art for show, and what the jurors are looking for.
but sometimes they do not know themselves. They only know it when they see it. |
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Starrpoint*
www.tschantz.myexpose.com
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docmanic
Posts:1
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| 11/29/2006 12:01 PM |
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Here's an anecdote that sheds a bit of light on the upper crust of the art world.
Around 1985, a young mining engineer in Scotland was given a watercolor
set by his girlfriend, He taught himself to use it sitting on his bed
in a 1 room appartment.
Some years later, he got a few pieces into a show somewhere. Both sold.
Thus encouraged, he sequestered himself and painted non stop for nearly
a year, often for 12 hours a day. Eventually he was persuaded to do a
solo show, something he resisted until then because he was afraid his
work might not sell.
Well, it did, and it sold well, and our man never looked back.
Recently, one of his paintings, 'The Singing Butler," sold at auction
for about $1.4M. He is Jack Vettriano, the most popular living artist
in the UK, and he is self-taught. His prints outsell the classics in
that country. By all the standards we hold dear, this man is a complete
success.
Here's the kicker. The critics all hate him. How can that be, you ask?
Could it be they hate him because he does not need them? Could it be
they hate him because they did not predict his success? I'll let you
figure it out.
Now we know we can't really trust the critics, and that includes galleries, jurors, and all others who can say no to us.
But to put it in perspective, the critics (read galleries) don't buy
art. Ordinary people do. The gallery has to sell to them in order to
earn a living from {your} art. That means your art has to be more
desirable somehow than whatever is hanging beside it. Otherwise, it
does not make sense for them to take up space with it.
In the end, the more people love your art, the more money you will
make, and the more successful you will appear to be. But none of that
is likely to happen before we achieve a measure of excellence in the
studio. And that comes only with persistent practice and diligent
study.
Will
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grimmy1
Posts:38
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| 11/30/2006 12:35 PM |
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Hello all , new to the forum , but just had to post a little something on this topic.I'm relatively new to the "art world" per say , but have had lots of experience with rejection . I just wanted to point out that no matter how much pain or rejection we've encountered in the past , negative remarks and rejection slips still hurt . I feel especially so for artists because we're such a sensitive group. It is so difficult for me to envision one person loving a painting and someone else laughing at it...but it makes sense.I've had a friend litterally laugh at a recent work, it crushed my confidence.,and I didn't paint for six weeks.God forgive us for the time we've wasted on others peoples' opinions. Keep painting and try to stay positive..
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Starrpoint
Posts:186
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| 11/30/2006 12:53 PM |
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It is good that you do not let your early rejection make you bitter and mean. A lot of people do. But you can see how life does give you more chances to find the right spot.
So often the rejection in school is just that we are not average.
But do not dispare if someone laughts at a painting, at least you are getting a reaction! and Don't take it negatively, getting a laugh can be a compliement, at least they looked at it. |
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Starrpoint*
www.tschantz.myexpose.com
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Starrpoint
Posts:186
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| 11/30/2006 1:01 PM |
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They hate him because he is not a part of the system. Largely because he is self taught, (they have studied for years, and cannot sell anything) and he is GOOD. Most of the "folk artist" they promote are really poor artist.
Jack can DRAW, and a lot of educated artists today cannot. |
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Starrpoint*
www.tschantz.myexpose.com
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K-kid
Posts:1
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| 12/01/2006 2:00 AM |
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My question is, on November 28 someone in the forum recommended a writer who sells art marketing books online for $24.95 - the name might be Jack White. BUT, I have lost the website address and cannot find it in the forum. Do you know what it is? Thank you!
Kathleen |
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Oilartist
Posts:25
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| 12/02/2006 1:35 PM |
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| I have a problem with the "EDUCATED -vs- SELF-TAUGHT" artist. I am a self-taught painter http://groups.msn.com/ghassanrached/pictures look for all albums by G DERBY. But my problem is the educated or so-called professional belittles me, becasue I am not school trained and I get discouraged. So to eleviate all that drama, I disassociate msyelf from everybody and just paint and sketch alone. I do not need to be heckled by an educated idiot. I thought Monet was self-taught, and not to mention poor, also heckled by the educated that his works were worthless.........look at his noteriety now. What is my point......it does not matter how a piece of art has presented itself, only thing matters is that it was visualized and then materialized. |
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Starrpoint
Posts:186
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| 12/02/2006 5:58 PM |
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I have no problem with real critique when appropriate, by someone educated in art, but it seems that most people with these "credintials" do not know when and how to critque. they also do not know when it is appropriate.
They seem to think they are always "on" and offer "advice" or most often ridicule when it is not necessary, appropriate or wanted.
Many people paint for many reasons.
If they have not offered the work up for critque, don't offer it,
And there is no right or wrong way to paint.
While a fine art educatiion can improve your skills and apprication for art, it cannot give you talent you do not have to begin with. |
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Starrpoint*
www.tschantz.myexpose.com
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bluiiz
Posts:522
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| 12/05/2006 6:47 AM |
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| I so agree! Those who can do.... I am fortunate to have met and been able to work under the guidance of a master pastelist who never "criticizes". She will show you where you went wrong in a much nicer helpful way. That, also is an art. No one else I ever met through my life was able to do that, and consequently, as I know has happened to others, I gave up. Now, that I am older and more confident, I have the courage to paint even if it sucks, so that I can really LEARN. |
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Oilartist
Posts:25
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| 12/06/2006 2:17 PM |
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| It is a blessing to be mentored by someone who is educated and possess a heart. Someone who sees a potential in their mentees. I to have been blessed to paint with Frankie Lanier alias PeeWee, who used to paint on PBS in Lubbock Texas, and now has workshop at a local Michaels Art Store. So please do not construe my last comments towards those with a degree. I just do not associate with the snooty ones who shove their piece of paper in your face---just because they have a degree. Does having a degree give the artist the right to critisize so bad that the painter has thoughts of giving up the practice altogether? I think not, however, I feel the educated should see potential (not confused with competition) and mentor with positive reinforecements, instead of hurting an artists feelings. |
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dew_art
Posts:7
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| 12/17/2006 4:39 PM |
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Posted By Marian on 07/23/2006 8:25 PM
Hi,
I've submitted some of my work to a few competitions and twice to a gallery. I was able to show work in one gallery in a group show and have won a few prizes but mostly I've gotten a nice letter back about how there were many fine examples of work submitted and they appreciate my work and I should try again next time.
I know people's work gets rejected all of the time. And I know it's almost par for the course. However, I guess my problem is, that I'm not sure what needs to be done to NOT get rejected. I really don't know if my works get rejected because they've got major flaws or because they're not the style the group or gallery was looking or WHY?
I also wonder why it matters to me. I SHOULD be able to paint just for me. But I guess I've gotten to the point where I really would like to sell my work and or show my work and I guess that means I have to paint for more than just me....
What are your thoughts...? Have you had similar experiences?? Is anyone in the same situation?? Any suggestions???
Marian, you're not the only one dealing with gallery rejections. The best advice is to NEVER QUIT. I've been told to keep knocking gallery doors until someone is willing to give you a chance. It may be a while before it happens, just don't give up.
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Doug
WEBSITE: www.deweststudios.com
WEBLOG: www.dewstudios.blogspot.com
"If I could say it in words there would be no reason to paint." – Edward Hopper
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Elvira2
Posts:10
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| 12/25/2006 5:23 PM |
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Hi - in reply to your query on rejection! Don't know what the answer is except DON'T get depresssed about it! Just keep trying. I think that paintings often get rejectec just because they are not the sort of subject that that particular selector/juror likes -ie: if he/she likes landscapes and you have put in paintings of, say, portraits,flowers or animals, then they are far more likely to choose a landscape painting than anything else. I realise they shouldn't do that, but do you yourself not find that when looking at an exhibition you tend to gravitate towards the subjects that you like to do., and I suppose the selectors are the same. I think the answer is - Try, Try and Try again and develop a thick skin.!! At some point,someone,somewhere will like your paintings.
Meanwhile, as its Christmas Day I will wish you and everyone a Happy Christmas and best wishes for the New Year. Good luck with your art in 2007 and beyond, and here is a w/c painting I did for Christmas. If you like it, have a look at my web site: www.florapaint.co.uk
Elvira - (from the UK) |
_BAL 480 x 360 August 2006.jpg)
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Marian
Posts:183
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| 01/11/2007 10:22 PM |
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It is great to have colleagues far and wide with similar experiences and supportive advice. As one of you said, if you get some of your work accepted or acknowledged positively, it really does take the sting out of the rejections.
I recently painted an action portrait of my friend's son because my friend passed away and I needed to do something to help me work through the pain of losing her. It was very rewarding to me... I love the painting and think the family will enjoy getting it.... So as you have all said, there are many reasons we paint.... not just to sell or to get into shows.
Sometimes we paint to see better or to feel more deeply.
Marian |
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Sometimes we paint to see more clearly or to feel more deeply.
Marian
www.marianfortunati.com
www.fortunatifineart.com |
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Marian
Posts:183
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| 01/26/2007 6:08 PM |
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I was so excited recently. One of my paintings was juried in to the Palm Springs Art Museum Artists Council 38th Annual National Juried Exhibition.
Kinda makes the rejections easier to take when an acceptance comes in!! Good luck to all of you and keep on painting!! |
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Sometimes we paint to see more clearly or to feel more deeply.
Marian
www.marianfortunati.com
www.fortunatifineart.com |
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Marian
Posts:183
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| 04/04/2007 2:12 PM |
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I learned another important lesson first hand recently!
Just as so many of you have said.... And in my head I knew it was true.... The judging is very subjective and we should just keep on trying.
That said, what happened most recently emphasizes the point.
The painting that was juried into the National Juried Show in Palm Springs (the I'm standing next to in my little picture) was recently juried OUT of a more local juried show!! Funny... I submitted 4 for that one... Three had juried into shows before and one had been juried OUT. For this one the one that had been juried OUT was juried IN ... they took another that was juried into three other shows and they juried OUT the one from the big museum show I was in.
Really a first hand affirmation of all you've said about subjectivity and to keep on trying.
I was lucky enough be invited to have the opportunity to watch the jurying process in action for an upcoming show for California Art Club Patrons. I'm sure it will be very interesting and I'm sure I will learn from the process. Howevery, what I just learned from submitting the same work to several shows is really really valuable.
I hope you all keep on trying .... If you want to share and learn from one another, local clubs in your area are great venues for this!!!
Keep on painting! |
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Sometimes we paint to see more clearly or to feel more deeply.
Marian
www.marianfortunati.com
www.fortunatifineart.com |
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