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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/02/2006 2:47 PM |
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| So much passes for art now a days, I wonder what you think determines good art from bad art. What do you think are the bottom line criteria for one to say this is good art but that one is bad art?Is it all subjective, or can we be objective and judemental about it? |
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Jerry
Posts:98
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| 10/02/2006 7:11 PM |
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Boy Sammy that question has been asked probably since the first saber tooth tiger was drawn on the wall of a cave someplace.
I think the bottom line criteria is what is behold in the eye of the holder. It is all subjective but as we see here we can also be objective and judgemental. Personally I have been most impressed with ability of some of the artists on the forum who can offer indepth critique (spl) of art. To me that is a real talent. My wife has a degree in art and I remember when she was in school she always enjoyed that part of her classes and classes in art history with an instructor who is well versed and knows their stuff. Our daughter is taking an art history class this quarter and I'm wouldn't be surprised if it makes a real impression on her.
Jerry |
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We Seal The Deal |
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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/02/2006 9:38 PM |
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Jerry,
Thank you for your reply. I sense a sort of ambiguity in your answer in that you say art is all subjective but at the same time we can be objective and judgemental. If someone is critiquing a work then he or she must be using some criteria and it is that which I want to know about. Also the instructor who knows his stuff must have some knowledge that we don't have and is using that as a criteria too. Therefore , I ask what makes good art and what makes bad art? |
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connie
Posts:445
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| 10/03/2006 12:29 AM |
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I think art is subjective, objective, and can be taken as judemental based on the appreciations for various forms of art by others and especially judges.
Note, opinions or critques by other artist are shared personal reflections of how someone else feels about the art, as would someone who viewed the art in considering purchasing, or commissions, galleries, or competitions but never shares with the artist.
I think there are to many variables to consider critques or comments here as judgemental.
Art is for the individual and most artist are happy if others enjoy their art also.
Most artist feel art is a life time endeavor and appreciate the opportunity for possible insight from other artist and do not think about it being judgemental. I also feel it is only with grace, maturity, and growth that artists can receive opinions or critques and not take it as jugemental.
Connie |
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heatherm
Posts:2120
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| 10/03/2006 12:52 PM |
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| I agree with Connie. I love to read the critiques by other artists on the different pieces of work, including my own. I have learned a lot by just reading these comments and seeing the paintings through the eyes of other artists. I don't think of a critique as being judgemental at all, just advice and helpful hints on how to improve a painting (which is an individual thing). We are free to take the advice or not. I take the advice if it is in the direction that I want to go, which is realism. However, critiques on impressionistic works and the different mediums have also given me some info I can work into my own paintings. This way we learn what works in our paintings and what doesn't work. |
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Heather
http://www.heatherartist.com |
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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/03/2006 11:22 PM |
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I found this quote on the internet re good and bad art. What do you think then: is there good and bad art?
There is no doubt that elderly artists deserve respect in their successes and failures because, as you say, "they have paid their dues." Maybe this scenario is more common than I think, but in my spectrum, what happens when it is young artists throwing a bunch of crap together on a plate in 2 minutes and calling it art? How much of an annoyance is it, when these young people, who probably happens to either be a son or daughter of an art critique, museum curator, or university professor, get rave reviews and gallery shows for lining up a row of old beer cans or tampons and picking a trendy cause to back it up? What are the dedicated artists spending hours a day in their studios mixing, sculpting, painting, weaving, etc...supposed to believe? That it doesn't matter what you do, but who you know? So bravo to the elderly painter and their bad painting, because at least he took the time to sit down and compose and feel enough to pick up a brush.
Tahtiana tahtiana@magpage.com
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connie
Posts:445
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| 10/06/2006 2:51 PM |
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I agree with Heather also.
And Life isn't fair - per Tahtiana tahtiana@magpage.com message.
Yes 'I' do believe there is good and bad art -
But that doesn't have to stop the spirit that tries to follow his own muse
and grow by the sincere critiques of others or not.
And if he/she like their own work as is (being bad art to me or others) - to each his own.
It is our individual responsibility to 'guard our own heart' and not become bitter or
negative by our perception of our life experiences regardless of the nature of those experiences.
connie
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klippie
Posts:1866
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| 10/14/2006 8:18 PM |
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Sammy
I had an art teacher who said "critiqes is frustrated artists" witch tells you how much to thimk of most of them, any human beiing has a taste and that also comes into consideration when they crit your work but it is good to hear crits and ther think about what they are sayiing, thed decide if according to you it is really grounded.
klippie |
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If at first you dont succeed.........don't ever give up! |
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diletto
Posts:4
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| 10/15/2006 11:50 PM |
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Sammy,
It must be subjective. Just as each of us paints for our own reasons, and finds our own subject matter and styles. How boring it would be if we all were to me moved or inspired by the same things. Good and bad are abstract terms anyway, so there must be as many reasons to paint as there are reasons to be moved/inspired by various works of art. Ultimately (for what it's worth), it seems that most artists I know, are our own worst critics |
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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/16/2006 2:46 PM |
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diletto,
Did you mean that most artists are their own worst critics? |
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diletto
Posts:4
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| 10/16/2006 3:54 PM |
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| Yes Sammy. That's exactly what I mean. Especially when it comes to our own artwork |
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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/21/2006 11:15 PM |
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This was taken from the internet re: good and bad art.What do you think?
Making judgments of value requires a basis for criticism. At the simplest level, a way to determine whether the impact of the object on the senses meets the criteria to be considered art, is whether it is perceived to be attractive or repellent. Though perception is always colored by experience, and can be necessarily subjective, it is commonly taken that that which is not aesthetically satisfying in some fashion cannot be art. However, "good" art is not always or even regularly aesthetically appealing to a majority of viewers. In other words, an artist's prime motivation need not be the pursuit of the aesthetic. Also, art often depicts terrible images made for social, moral, or thought-provoking reasons. For example, Francisco Goya's painting depicting the Spanish shootings of 3rd of May 1808, is a graphic depiction of a firing squad executing several pleading civilians. Yet at the same time, the horrific imagery demonstrates Goya's keen artistic ability in composition and execution and his fitting social and political outrage. Thus, the debate continues as to what mode of aesthetic satisfaction, if any, is required to define 'art'. |
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heatherm
Posts:2120
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| 10/22/2006 10:52 AM |
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Sammy,
I mostly agree with what you have quoted above. I know the paintings I like to look at, paintings I don't understand completely - such as abstract art - and paintings that don't do anything for me. That is not to say that I am right or wrong, it is my personal emotional reaction to a painting (this is the subjective part). When looking at a painting, the first thing I look for is the skill and talent of the artist, a solid foundation in drawing skills, prescpective and compositional factors, and the use of colors and values. The subject matter is secondary to me. I have seen paintings that were considered "awful" and really liked them.
I love to see talent no matter where it takes an artist in their growth. To me a "bad" painting is something I find disgusting, and that is very few. Look at Gramdma Moses' work, she paints in a very primitave style, breaking some rules, and her work is delightful. I wouldn't hang it on my wall though as that is not the kind of art I would want to collect.
So, I think it is up to the artist and veiwer to decided if it is good or not. I don't like the word "bad" because if a handcapped or untalented person is creating from his/her soul and doesn't measure up to others standards, it doesn't make it "bad" art. They are expressing themselves as passionately as the masters, and who can say their art is not good, someone will like it. |
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Heather
http://www.heatherartist.com |
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ronnie
Posts:214
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| 10/25/2006 12:02 AM |
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I paint realisiam, but I love art enough to appreceiate other types of art ,evan some abstract, I love van gogh,Monet [etc] I say that ,hopeing to show that I'm not closed minded to other types of art, now..my answer....yes ther is good and bad art! a drawing that is not drawn that well is not necessarily bad art.
ther is art for arts sake, and then there is JUNK.
Ronnie |
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sammy
Posts:691
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| 10/25/2006 9:21 AM |
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Ronnie,
The problem remains-who is to decide? |
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jbmerrill
Posts:274
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| 10/26/2006 6:54 AM |
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I think we've all asked this question somewhere down the line and this quote comes to my mind whenever I hear it.
The appreciation of art is so highly personal and subjective that it defies scientific analysis. What makes great art is something that moves the inner spirit and fires the imagination of the observer, it manages to transcend the simple application of paint to canvas...
- Sandra Forty, The World of Art
To me it's kind of like music; there's what you like though I might hate it or a simple three cord tune that sells a million copies that made you smile.
Art is good or bad and that decision is final per observer. Hell of a topic Sammy. |
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Jim Merrill
www.workingcanvas.com
If you hear a voice within you say "you cannot paint," then by all means paint, and that voice will be silenced. -van Gogh
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J RAMESH
Posts:344
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| 10/26/2006 8:09 AM |
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There is one critic here who writes for well known newspaper. The same news paper has published articles on me on several occassions. But this critic is very critical about my art. When ever i hold exhibition, i will make it point to invite her, even though i know she dont like my art. She just walks friom one end of the hall to other and walks out with out even saying hello to me. and the next week there is small write up in newspaper saying nothing mucht to write home about this paritcular artist.
then there is one more critic, came to my mind after reading Klippie's statement "critics are frustrated artists'[continues with ...witch tell you..... i want to ask Klippie whether it was spelling mistake or she meant it]
ok this critic, was one such artist.He use to write to many newspapers. I showed him my album of art. he just rushed through and told me on the face " we dont encourage such art" some questions arised in my mind. are these critics art police? i wanted to invite him for joint exhibition and see who gets good public responses. But he was senior artist and i did not want to educate him. I have spoken well with my art buyers. indirectly trying to know why they bought my art. most of my buyers where first time art buyers. |
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J RAMESH
Posts:344
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| 10/26/2006 8:46 AM |
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| We cant paint all the critics in the same brush. many of the critics we come across including in this forum, give critic with in the spheres of our interest, like color scheme, drawing , layout etc,.. they are very comfortable and help an artist to grow much. But some try to say what is an art what is not, they make some artist feel he has lost his way. |
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Flags!
Posts:13
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| 10/26/2006 7:49 PM |
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| I've seen paintings that look like the stuff my kids bring home from school selling for thousands of dollars -- but who is to say what is good or bad. If you're selling your paintings and they don't sell -- well that might be a hint. I've seen some pretty gross stuff out there but to someone else it might be exciting, experimental, etc. It's all in the eye of the beholder. Even Van Gogh had a few paintings that I feel weren't really that good, but I'd own one in a New York minute if someone was passing them out! |
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klippie
Posts:1866
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| 10/27/2006 2:14 AM |
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It was actually an spelling mistake, I am not against cirtuques it has a good purpose, I have seen very good art been dissaproved off and just wonder sometimes of what my art school teacher have said is not true in some cases, I have found here, in South Africa, galleries for instance crit according to their clientelle's taste, just wondering what that really means in form of crits. Good or bad art it differs on peoples taste. to me bad art is dead cats an weird things because they carry the wrong message accross.
klippie |
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If at first you dont succeed.........don't ever give up! |
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